After more than a decade of shorter-distance ultrarunning, David Roche is debuting at the 2025 Western States 100 as one of the men’s favorites, courtesy of his course record-setting win at the 2024 Leadville 100 Mile. In this interview, conducted before the race from home, David talks about his training block leading up to the race, how his very public minor injury from a few months ago is doing, and if — among his science-based racing strategies — he still believes in the magic of race day.
To learn more about who’s racing, check out our women’s and men’s previews and follow our live race coverage on race day.
[Editor’s Note: If you are unable to see the video above, click here to access it.]
David Roche Pre-2025 Western States 100 Interview Transcript
iRunFar: Meghan Hicks of iRunFar. I’m with David Roche. It’s a week or so before the 2025 Western States 100. Hey, David. How are you?
David Roche: So, I think this is my first ever athlete interview, which is just the ultimate honor.
iRunFar: I know. We have interviewed you and Megan [Roche] a couple of times over the years for various profile pieces. We’ve called on you as a resource when we’re fact checking stuff. We’ve gotten athletes’ contact information from you, but I think this is our first on camera interview. So, it’s a privilege for me too.
Roche: I know, and every single year that we’ve been at Western States, you know, we’re always coaching there. And I see you out there standing next to the beautiful mountains with your microphone up in people’s faces. So, I’m just sad that I had to say no to that opportunity because it’s a little bit too close to the race for me, and I’m trying to do something big for myself. But thank you for making the time to do it early.
iRunFar: Yeah. All good to preserve the well-being of race week. My first question for you is, when we talk to athletes about Western States, I feel like there’s this dichotomous approach to it. People are like, meh. Western States. Okay. It’s not like, the most beautiful course, or is it overhyped at this point because so much is put into it. Or people are like, “Hell yeah Western States!” And there’s always a turning point for somebody where they’re like, yeah, me, Western States.
Roche: Yeah.
iRunFar: You’ve been a part of the Western State scene for years. You’ve come to it as a coach. You’ve spectated it. Now you’re approaching it as an athlete. You’ve seen a bunch of the course as a runner. What was that turning point moment for you when you were like, “Hell yeah, me and Western States.”
Roche: Gosh. That was way before I even did trail races. Back in 2006, 2007, 2008, when I was first getting into running in college, I remember reading Anton [Krupicka]’s blog and all the blogs back then, Nick Clark’s blog, and just becoming enamored with the idea that this was humanly possible. And so much of that stemmed around Leadville [100 Mile] and Western States. And then you had the “Unbreakable” year at Western States. Where already, if you were attuned to that sort of thing, there’s just this burgeoning idea of, like, Wow. This wild thing is happening in sports. And I was a huge sports fan, a huge running fan, and so I became the biggest Killan [Jornet] fan at that time and have been since. And then just getting more involved in the sport myself. So, I think that that was the basis, like, the background for when coaching took off, and that became our main thing. You know, it was moderately successful, but still kind of as a lawyer, not a huge deal. And then Western States happened. And even back then, this was being channeled into the Super Bowl of U.S. trail running and, you know, we had some athletes have success early on in so many ways. Like, we owe what SWAP [Some Work All Play, the Roche’s coaching business] became to Western States.
And so, there’s this massive amount of gratitude we have toward it and respect for it, as an event. And then it’s just the gathering place of everybody now. So put it all together and this is the most special race in the world. And, I’m just so full of gratitude to be able to line up with my heroes. Literally, Kilian, one of my ultimate heroes, and experience it as an athlete for the first time and maybe the only time. You never know. And so, I’m going to cherish it like it’s the last time.
iRunFar: You ran your first 100-mile race last summer at Leadville. You crushed your first 100-mile race at Leadville. I mean, you have been an ultrarunner for over a decade now at this point, but, like, maybe people considered you slightly an underdog at that race because you hadn’t done 100 miles, and that’s also a really tricky one to get right. I feel like everyone and their brother and mother have tried Leadville, and it’s tricky. I think you’re no longer an underdog going into Western States.
This is kind of a two-part question. One, like, looking back, hindsight 20/20, to Leadville, when you look back at that, what do you see about yourself and your performance? And then how’s it different now looking forward to what’s happening in two weekends?
Roche: I embrace the underdog mentality still.
iRunFar: You still want to be the underdog.
Roche: I still want to be the underdog. Also, that might mean they let you get off the front. [laughs] Just kidding. That’s not going to happen. I don’t think anybody’s getting off the front this year. Yeah. I mean, I look back at it, and I think the reason I make the joke about underdog is because I do feel that way, generally, in the sense that, yes, I’ve done 50ks for a while. I started in 2014, but then the first time I went beyond 50k was in 2023, not till after Leo, our first child, was born, at Canyons. And then had a rough experience there. And then, after that, I learned, Okay, I need to totally overhaul my understanding of like, G.I. training and all the little things about what happens after like, hour six.
And because of that, and because of getting to learn from athletes to be coach, I went into Leadville feeling like, Okay, well, I don’t think on some level I’m capable of this. But at the same time, I have this helpful resource of getting to coach so many people like Clare Gallagher who has won both of these races.
So, when I went into it, it was like, Alright, let’s make a bet on ourselves, and on science, without knowing if it’s going to pay off. And in fact expecting it not to. Like, I went into Leadville and Megan expected it to work out the way it did. But and, yes, my pace chart said the exact time I got. But if I was, like, gun to head, I probably would have estimated a 5% chance of that happening. And same thing heading into Western States. So, I think, whether that’s imposter syndrome or just being honest about the magnitude of what you’re about to undertake, I think I have the same exact mindset I had last year. I just have a few more eyes on me this one.
Roche: You like, maybe your personal motto the last couple of races has been “no secrets.”
Roche: Mm hmm.
iRunFar: Just want to put out there everything that’s going on. So, there’s a lot of data out there on you between your Strava, your YouTube, all of your social media about what’s been going on, but I just want to touch in on a couple of things. First of all, your training. I think you’ve had a great training block. You had a bobble in there with a knee injury type thing, and then things have looked full steam ahead since then. Like, bigger picture zooming out. How does, as a coach and as an athlete, how does your training block look?
Roche: Yeah. Gosh. If you had gone back to December, which is when director Cody [Bare] did the first video on Western States and told me I’d be where I am now, a couple weeks before in the taper now, I would just have been, Oh my god. That’s amazing. And it points out that sometimes it’s easier to apply things as a coach. In fact, it’s much easier than to apply them as an athlete yourself. So coming into the Quad Rock 50 Mile, that performance was a huge. Knowing the history of that race and who’s done it and then gone on to success at Western States was a big confidence boost.
But at the finish line, Nick Clark, who’s crushed Western States many times, and we go way back that he’s seen the entire journey from when I was a runner that would finish 10th at races or whatever to what’s happened. And he said, just make sure you recover. And I probably was like, Well, he’s talking about I mean, some level as an athlete. Even as a coach, I agreed. And the knee injury that happened during the race just forced me to recover a little bit. And so now it’s totally clear, and I was able to get to the course and go hard on it. And I might, if I had not had that, I probably would have not heeded his advice, even knowing what I know about it, you know. Just because there’s such a temptation to go hammer and get into it.
And so, I mean, I sling-shotted out of it feeling just like a million bucks. I’m like, I don’t need to sleep. I don’t care if our kids wake up a million times. I’m good. So, yeah, I think it was one of those fortuitous moments where, in flying a little bit too close to the sun, I also backed off to make sure I’m not coming into the race burned. Because like, now I feel very recovered even though we’re literally just starting the taper as we’re recording this. So, you know, and I understand that in this race, I know I can get into Foresthill, like, high up in the field. The question is what happens after, and what happens after depends on the nervous system, and depends on recovery.
iRunFar: I think in other words, you might be saying either the universe or good old Nick Clark had, I don’t know, like, just poked the hornet’s nest a little bit there for you and forced a little universal recovery so that you could feel the fitness that you’ve been building on.
Roche: Yeah. And so just a wild part about life in general is that like, you know, when things work out, like, if Western States works out in the dream sense, there’s going to be all these little moments that seem destined from the universe. Like, I’ve gone back and been like, Wow, that’s wild. Like, even going back to last year that every little thing that happened was just to build this. But, you know, if it doesn’t, it’s just, like, oops. Maybe it’s the opposite. Maybe God or Nick Clark actually wants me to fail.
iRunFar: [laughs] God or Nick Clark. Are they the same?
Roche: Yeah. Yeah. I pray to both, just in case.
iRunFar: Just in case. You have talked a lot online about heat training, so I think maybe we’ll skip over that. But something I’m really curious to learn about you is over the last maybe, I don’t know, five years at Western States, there seems to be much more focus on race day cooling and just different things people are experimenting with to get core body temperature down in different parts of the race. What, no secrets.
Roche: Yeah.
iRunFar: What are you looking at in terms of like, cooling plans for race day? Now the forecast is looking okay but like, let’s just pretend that it skyrockets in the next little bit here.
Roche: Yeah. Realistically, I think, you know, we’re already looking at mid-nineties. I think it’s going to be higher. I think there’s just like, an anomalous forecast that might have been a little lower. So in the canyons, over 90 is always just a cook. Like, I got to experience it firsthand when I went to the course last week, and it was a 92-degree day. And I was like, this place is hotter than that, which is good because I was not cooling that day. And I got a firsthand experience of like, oh, crap. This is a cooling race. Like, you know, I’ve said a million years as a coach but, it made it important for me to see that like, it’s always worth the extra thirty seconds. But on that note, I don’t want it to be the extra minute thirty seconds. So, keep it really simple. I’m going to just be doing like, getting wet throughout, but then ice bandanas, ice in my big old funny bucket hat. And then I also put ice down my shirt which is bound by a belt at the bottom. And, you know, if I’m burning really hot, that lasts a little bit, but it also just kind of cools everything off. And that can usually be done in just like, 15 to 20 seconds. Because interestingly, I had never personally done an ice bandana or used ice in my race until the Javelina [100 Mile] last year, which was record heat. And I was like Oh, man. This is amazing. So now I’m going to do it at every race.
iRunFar: Funny how this works.
Roche: And then the second time I did it was at Quad Rock, and I’m like, maybe this whole time I’m just learning that ice, I’m like an ice responder. Like, that’s actually the main thing in training theory is I should just say, instead of running, I should just tell people: “Ice.” And like, have a company that sells it. Instead of The Feed, what would be called?
iRunFar: No need to train, just stay cold.
Roche: Yeah, exactly.
iRunFar: A question I’ve wanted to ask you for a long time and now I get to ask it in the context of Western States. You’re a self-glorified nerd and embracer of the data and embracer of all of the details, but there’s also this, what I see as a strong side of letting yourself feel the intangibles, the ethereal, the stuff that you can never write down and can’t come out in numbers. To you, how much is ultrarunning data, and how much is it feeling? Or put another way, how much is left brain, how much is right brain?
Roche: I mean, I think it’s still 95% feeling. The data just helps you calibrate feel slightly. Because I think, for me at least, one of the problems I have is I can get so into the magic of something, quote-unquote “magic” of something, that I delude myself away from feeling.
iRunFar: [laughs]
Roche: I think some of the best people that have ever done it are just physiological freaks that then also can apply that to feel. Maybe the best example is sweat rate. So, if we went back in time and tested all of the GOATs of ultrarunning, I almost guarantee that what we’d see to a person is astonishingly low sweat rates of the best ever to do it. And then drink-to-thirst becomes a message and you know, “Oh, you don’t actually need to think about,” but the problem is I’m a freak in the other direction. I have literally the highest sweat rate we have ever measured, and I’m not a huge guy or anything. And I think as much as carbs have been credited with all of what I’ve done in ultras in the last year, I think a lot of it just might be hydration in the sense of, oh, I am the freak on the other side.
And feel for me, by the time I listen to it, is so wrong that I’m already screwed. So, for me, the more data I can gather, the more I can understand why my body responds how it does, and then I can just let feel be the entire method of approaching it. And so, for me, it’s helpful like, on the escarpment and in the high country, yes I will be checking my heart rate to make sure that I’m not doing anything dumb, because it would be so easy to do something dumb. If you see me off the front of the race, or near the front of the race, you can be like, Alright. He actually, his feel is not getting too intense. But on the flip side, if I’m farther back, it’s like, Alright. He’s not having a bad day. Probably. He’s probably just, you know, paying attention to that. And then I will not pay attention to it one more time after we hit the canyons because at that point, you know, it’s just every man, woman, non-binary athlete for themselves.
iRunFar: When you listen to the stories of some of the GOATs and their like out of this world type performances, there’s a lot of them talk about these moments of where they weren’t, they were no longer in their bodies. They were running by flow. It was just all heart in that moment. It was no feeling. I mean, no thinking. It was all feeling. Have you had like, as a a self-embraced data geek, nerd, have you had those moments in your running so far where you’ve been able to just sort of let go of all the equations and algorithms and all the stuff running through your brain and just feel that in the moment, that very primal thing?
Roche: Yeah. I mean, I think it’s a cop out when people say that that’s how they feel and they attribute it to tuning everything else out, because I think flow state as defined by all the psychologists who have worked on it.
iRunFar: It’s like tuning in, isn’t it?
Roche: There’s such amount immense amount of preparation, right? Like, Steph Curry is not thinking about shooting a three, but it’s because he shot 40,000 threes and knows the exact launch angle and everything he wants to do going into it. And I think in running, especially in ultrarunning, not in track or roads. But like, in ultrarunning, there’s this idea that that’s impure, that I think is less of a big deal now, but it’s almost like a defense mechanism against caring a lot about the things that go into you giving you that feeling. And so, my goal as a coach is to hopefully help people harness that feeling and understand that it’s accessible to everybody, even people that are just starting out. And I think in a race, the idea is that, hopefully, by controlling the controllables, which aren’t that many, but there’s enough of them now that I think I can get this down to a science equation that then informs just absolutely vibey magic fest, you know.
And so, yeah, I will be checking my heart rate and possibly my core temp, but then I’ll also be running on everybody that I’m going to see you out there, and I’m going to tell you how f****** amazing you are, you know? And I think like, for me, I thought about this a lot before Leadville in relation to Matt Carpenter. As I put this back a lot there, and now I’m thinking about it a lot in relation to people like Jim Walmsley and Kilian Jornet and Scott Jurek and things like that. Which is if you took us all into a lab, I am not the fittest. I am not the best in any means. And that especially applies to those types of people, like, Matt Carpenter or whatever, highest VO2 max ever recorded in a runner. But if I can get these other things going, who knows, right? Like, ultras are weird. That’s the best part about them. It’s why it’s such a magical experience for everybody. And so yeah. Betting on science one more time to get me a little bit of that magic.
iRunFar: I love that. Two quick final questions for you. Predict David Roach’s finishing time.
Roche: Okay. I haven’t done the full spreadsheet yet. So, we can re-evaluate this in a minute. But right now, I’m thinking Oh my god. This is going to be so embarrassing if I run 20 hours. But again, no secrets. Right? Someone asking this, I will be direct. Course record’s 14:09. I think, probably 14:15 or so.
iRunFar: And what’s it going to take to get into the men’s top 10 this year? What’s the finishing time?
Roche: 14:40, 14:45, something like that. Maybe faster, maybe 14:30. I think the winner does have a shot at sub 14 this year. I think, you know, you look at obviously, Kilian, like, that’s a cop out. But Adam Petergod [Peterman], he’s no man. You know, like, I think his level is otherworldly. But because, you know, he had a couple years of getting healthy, people might have forgotten that he never loses. Then Rod [Farvard] is back, he’s the one who I’m basing my pace sheet off of. And I don’t look at splits during the race, but in terms of how I think about it, it’s all going off of Rod and how he changed the sport. And even look at someone that I think is being grossly underestimated, which is Seth Ruhling. You know, he can just glide up those steep climbs in the canyons in ways that defy expectations and gravity. And, you know, there’s so many athletes like that on the start line. And then, a couple I coach, Hans Troyer and Chris Myers. Both are, I mean, Chris Myers ran a 15:18 last year, and he’s world’s fitter. Hans just crushed the Canyons in the 100k and under the previous course record. And he’s such a mental beast. Like, if I wasn’t coaching him, he would be the last person I ever want to see in the last five miles, because I know he would kick my ass.
iRunFar: [laughs]
Roche: And you just put it together and it’s like, alright, man. This isn’t about competition against these people, because you think about that and it’s just overwhelming. This is about going out celebrating the sport, the community, the amount of gratitude to be there. And then hopefully, in this journey, whether I had a great day or a really terrible one, sharing it will make the tent of the sport just a little bit bigger. Bring a couple more in to get the feel that magic, but maybe they’ll have a heart rate monitor on while they’re feeling the magic.
iRunFar: Maybe that is the magic.
Roche: Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Didn’t wear one for this nor did I wear no shirt for this. So, I mean, non-magic.
iRunFar: I expected a little bit more. Like, I wanted the whole race day costume.
Roche: I know.
iRunFar: So, we’ll have to wait a few more days for that.
Roche: I even included the like, little chafing spot down on my shorts, so it was perfect.
iRunFar: Best of luck to you, and we really look forward to watching you make your debut journey from Olympic Valley to Auburn.
Roche: Thank you. I’m getting chills. I was out on the course last week, and I got to see, I first went to Dusty Corners to start to run through the canyons.
iRunFar: Did you kick up the dust just to feel the dust of Dusty Corners?
Roche: I did make some jokes about dustiness that are going to be on our YouTube.
iRunFar: It’s so dusty.
Roche: So dusty. But what I saw, and then saw again at Michigan Bluff, I saw the steep downhill into Dusty Corners. And I’m like, I have seen so many iRunFar photos in that same spot. Because like, every year.
iRunFar: You have it memorized.
Roche: Oh my god. The photo spots, every year I have, you know, just been updating iRunFar so many times, and the debt of gratitude that we have, in the same way that I say SWAP was formed by Western States, it’s like we all were formed by iRunFar. This opportunity, how much our lives have changed, how much all of these other businesses have sprouted up. It’s like we are standing on your shoulders and hopefully helping lift you guys up, too. So, I can’t wait to just be out there and get to see you on course. Like, so cool. You’ve also seen actually, this is another flashback. I know we’re taking more time. You know, when I say I’m an underdog, I think people are like some people that are especially newer, like, “What is he talking about?” You were at the Trail World Championships in 2017 where you saw me finish almost last place in the entire race. So, you understand the types of experiences that inform my underdog feelings.
iRunFar: Well, it’s actually, when you talked about having gone from was it 2014 to 2023?
Roche: Yeah.
iRunFar: Having not moved up from the 50k to 100k distance. Because 2017 Worlds was…
Roche: It was a 50k.
iRunFar: Was it a 50 miler?
Roche: No.
iRunFar: It was a 50k.
Roche: 50k with a lot of vert. But, yeah, 50k.
iRunFar: Got it.
Roche: In like, somewhat hot conditions.
iRunFar: It was hot that day.
Roche: I mean, not compared to Western States. And I never thought I could go, I mean every 50k I did I was like, dying at the end even when it went okay. So you’ve seen me cramping on the side of the trail and suffering in that way and hopefully still being positive that hopefully, you get to get a full circle picture of it too.
iRunFar: Well, my only hope for you on race day is that the people out there give back to you the amount of positivity that you put out into the world. I think you’re deserving of that on your race day.
Roche: Oh my god. Well, that’s the thing that I’m going to just cherish is this is going to be a scene unlike any other. I don’t know if they’re prepared. Like, I don’t know. I think that the amount of people that are going to be on the course and out there this year, and just the amount that the sport has grown. And I think it’s like, a part of everything else that’s just like, people are feeling more excited and open in the sport and all of this other stuff led by, you know, now iRunFar and now FreeTrail who’s building off that and, Singletrack. There’s just so much joy and all that. It’s like, I am just so giddy about one, the escarpment, like, at the top. Right? Like, I can’t wait to experience that. And then, Robinson Flat coming in is going to be bonkers. But then, Foresthill, they do not have enough parking for what’s about to happen. And yeah. I mean, the cool thing is I’m going to be able to get those experiences no matter what, as long as I can be healthy. And so, what a celebration. And, yeah, I just, anyone who’s listening this long to an iRunFar interview is probably a super fan of the sport. And I just want to thank you for being here and caring, because it’s just wild that we get to all experience this together.
iRunFar: The gratitude, man. Best of luck to you.
Roche: Okay, that’s my trail name.
iRunFar: Now you’re going to do a long trail. Alright. We can talk forever, but cut.
Roche: You’re the best! Bye bye!
